How To Overcome Failure and Find Real Success, with James Fell

[00:00:00] Track 1: You and I spoke a few years ago. You were promoting your book, uh, the Holy Shit Moment, all about those epiphanies we have in life where, you know, it's, we're onto the next great thing.

[00:00:08] And that seemed like it was gonna be the next great thing, but it didn't quite turn out that way for you.

[00:00:13] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: It did not it. Uh, um, you know, I kind of realized that, uh, with self-help books that, you know, having, having an MBA, one of the things they teach in business is to, to under promise and over

[00:00:30] deliver. And I realized after the fact with self-help, that it's kind of the opposite that they, they want the, the most, uh, bestselling self-help books. Generally speaking. The popular type ones are the ones that over promise that you know, you'll be rich and thin and successful and, and a sex machine and happy and all that kind of stuff.

[00:00:53] And, uh, so that's the overpromise. And the other deliver is basically just rah rah, you can do it ad nauseum. There's not [00:01:00] actually a real plan. And, and my book was, was not in line with that. It was very science-based. Um, I was, I was very measured in the type of, uh. Of proclamations I made about what you could accomplish. And, and the program was that I developed was arduous. Like you had to work.

[00:01:20] And, and that. was when people, yeah, Nobody wants that shit. And, uh, can, can I swear?

[00:01:25] Well, you said the, you said the name of the book, the holy Shit

[00:01:27] moment, so I guess that's all right. Um. Yeah, so the, uh, the thing was, I, I realized too late that a lot of people that, you know, they don't buy one self-help book. They buy like 20 of

[00:01:39] them. And the reason why is that they don't necessarily wanna change.

[00:01:43] They want to feel good while they're reading the book. They wanna make, they wanna believe that everything's gonna be okay

[00:01:48] and it's not gonna take that much work. And, uh, and my book wasn't like that. It was not a feel good book. And, uh, and so I, uh, I switched. [00:02:00] Away from giving people 

[00:02:02] advice, and, and because people didn't want my advice. Uh, and I changed over to, uh, just telling stories

[00:02:11] Track 1: Yeah. Well, which is 

[00:02:13] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: that worked out better. 

[00:02:13] Track 1: as it turns out, that is something people want, is they do want stories. But you, you speak to, one of the biggest frustrations I have in in self-help is everyone forgets the self part. You know, they, they'll spend 10 grand on some coaching program because it is promising the sun and the moon.

[00:02:26] But nobody ever bothers to tell them that. Yeah, you still have to do all of the stuff that the coaching program tells you. It's, it's a brutal field where you, many in the field that are successful rely on their celebrity, and that's kind of where it ends. Like people think, oh, this person's successful.

[00:02:41] I'll read their book and then I'll magically be them.

[00:02:44] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Mm-Hmm.

[00:02:45] Track 1: So.

[00:02:46] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Yeah. It's, and change is incredibly hard. Like I, I studied it so much, um, you know, read all the, the actual legitimate science behind cognitive behavior change and, uh, you know, dedicated a big chunk of my [00:03:00] career to it, and, and knew a lot of the tips and tricks and things like that. Still, like, just being so heavily involved in it, I still really struggle, but like, it's just it's still, it's, it's a hard thing

[00:03:17] to do. And, uh, and I, and so I understand why, you know, it's, there's a, a new book out. I can't remember his first name is, uh, Spolsky's, the last

[00:03:28] the last name of the author about how we are, there's no such thing. As free will, and which I don't believe I, I think that's

[00:03:37] crap. But, uh, but I, I do think that that overcoming, you know, the, the wide variety of life experiences, uh, that we have does make it very difficult for people to change, you know, inertia sets in and, uh, and to, to really become a different person [00:04:00] is, is not an easy thing to do for a lot of

[00:04:02] people. 

[00:04:03] Track 1: Well you did, you made a big change. You were forced by, I, I, you know, based on the stories and everything I've read about this, that based on the lack of success of that book, you were forced to make a big change in, in the way you were, uh, in, in what you were offering the world. So talk us through that process of what, what did you go through mentally when you sort of realized, ah, this ain't working.

[00:04:21] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Oh God, I was in a state of despair,

[00:04:25] It was, uh, yeah. And, and you know what's funny is at the time it felt like the world had come to an end career-wise. Anyway, um, you know, my home life was great. Uh, still is, you know, married to a wonderful woman, uh, a family physician, and, and the, uh, the advice that I give to every aspiring author is to marry a doctor.

[00:04:45] Track 1: Solid advice. Yeah.

[00:04:46] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: But But, uh, yeah, at the time I was really upset that the book had not taken off. I thought that, you know, this was, I'd had one book published five years earlier that was, uh, by Random House Canada. We couldn't sell it in the United [00:05:00] States. That was a weight loss Get In Shape book, um, that I was proud of. And then this book, the Holy Shit Moment came out in 2019. That was my, my North American, uh, book that, you know, got quite a decent advance for. And, um, And that I was thinking this was gonna launch me, you know, beyond fitness into sort of general sort of science-based self-help group thing. And, and now in hindsight, I am so happy it didn't sell like it was at the time.

[00:05:30] It's sucked, but, but now it's like if it had taken off. I think that would've been bad for me because I don't really like the self-help industry, and it wasn't like I was writing what I thought, you know, the market wanted and what publishers wanted, and not writing what I really wanted to do. Like what? I was more a storyteller than it. Than an advice giver.

[00:05:57] And, and if I was still writing those books [00:06:00] now, because like say the book had become a bestseller and I was, you know, on my third or fourth self-help book, I'm not sure I would really enjoy doing that right

[00:06:08] now. But yeah. So walking you through the how I, I got to become the sweary historian was, um, the, the book had been out. For a year, and it was obviously not going anywhere. And my agent, you know, basically said, I can't sell you, you know, you're only as good as your last book. Right. And, uh, and you know, we, we were gonna talk about possible ideas for another book, but I wasn't excited about any of them. Like, I just didn't, I didn't wanna write another self-help book and, but I needed money because I'd gotten my last Installment for the book and there was the, the freelancing. Articles had kind of dried up because I'd taken a risk moving from fitness into, into general self-help. And, uh, and so [00:07:00] that was, uh, there was no money

[00:07:01] coming in at all. And I thought, okay, I had, I'd been doing public speaking along the way just to bolster the, the writing thing.

[00:07:08] And I thought, fine. There's, I know that there's good money in public speaking and I know that I've got the sales skills, the hustle. To make it happen. And I had a book, a motivational book that I, I could become, you know, after a couple years of hard work really building it up, I figured I could make quite a good living as a public

[00:07:26] speaker and, you know, then I could try and find a way to, to reinvent my writing career and, and, or, or find a new way to, to breathe new life into it. But money was the priority and, uh, but then, you know, just as I was starting to book. These speaking gigs, fucking covid you know?

[00:07:48] Track 1: timing. Awesome timing.

[00:07:50] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Yeah. How, how the hell do you start a speaking career and just at the beginning of a worldwide pandemic? And the answer is you don't.

[00:07:58] And, and so that was when [00:08:00] the despair really hit because it's like, what am I going to do?

[00:08:04] I've, I've been out of the, the general workforce, you know, I was a market trade. I have an MBA, I'd worked in marketing. I hadn't had a real job for a dozen

[00:08:11] years. And, uh, and plus, you know, married to a physician, she was saying, uh, right at the beginning that this covid thing is bad. It's going to last for a long time.

[00:08:22] And, uh, and you know, politically it looked like the world was going to shit. I referred to 2020 as that entire year as just a spectacular shit. NATO of ass was the way I described

[00:08:32] Track 1: spot on. That's a, 

[00:08:33] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: And .So yeah, what happened was, you know, I wrote a book about life-changing epiphanies, and I, I kind of got good at 

[00:08:43] recognizing them. Um, the first one was more of an idea than an epiphany. Literally the only asset that I had in my career at that moment was, uh. A Facebook page with 80,000 followers. And, and I got this idea on April 17th, 2020, uh, while I was out for a bike [00:09:00] ride, which is where most of my good ideas come, that I could, I could do a, a profanity filled history post that was in an on this day 

[00:09:07] format. 

[00:09:08] Track 1: Mm-Hmm.

[00:09:09] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: And, you know, it wasn't like a big lightning bulb, it was just an idea like, yeah, I could do that.

[00:09:14] People that follow my page, like the way I write.

[00:09:18] More than what I was really writing

[00:09:20] about. And I, I'd been branching out into sort of different areas, social justice stuff I'd been writing about and, and, um, so I, I looked something up for April 18th, which was when Martin Luther, um, I.

[00:09:34] After he'd, you know, done his, his 95, uh, thesis thing was called before the, uh, the Holy Roman Emperor Charles, the VI think, uh, at the de of Vers, uh, where basically Martin Luther said You know, get fucked. I'm not backing down on this Protestant Reformation thing.

[00:09:53] And, uh Oh yeah, it's exactly it's totally what he said. And, [00:10:00] uh, and and the Holy Roman emperor was like, no, fuck you. I'm declaring you an outlaw. And if anyone wants to kill this guy, they can. and and so that was, I posted that and it did okay. Like, you know, it got, it was, it was. Not super popular, but it, it did

[00:10:16] all right. And uh, and I thought literally I have Nothing going on right now. , like there's, there's nothing career-wise in my life. So I will do another for the next day. And, and so I wrote another one for April 19th, which was about May West, uh, famous, you know, early film starlet that it was actually before she became a film star. I think it was 1927. Um, she was arrested. Uh, and sent to jail for her first ever Broadway play, which was titled Sex, and she didn't just star in it. She wrote, produced, and directed it. And so she was sent to jail for 10 [00:11:00] days for corrupting. The morals of youth

[00:11:02] was, was what? She was sent to jail for. I wrote a lot about, you know, puritanism, like the Puritan invasion in the 16th century and how it molded American, you know, uptightness about sex and how that influence was what ended up getting her thrown in jail.

[00:11:17] And they said, well, you can just pay a fine May. And she was like, Nope. Fuck you. Throw me in jail. Like just.

[00:11:22] She wanted to make a

[00:11:23] statement about it. And then after she got outta jail, her next play was about homosexuality in 1927. So she was a real, uh, you know, the, a delicious rogue that was just not putting up with any of this bullshit and that. Post really blew up

[00:11:41] and there were people in the comments saying, you should do an entire year's worth of these and you should turn it into a book. And I was like, you're god damn right. I should

[00:11:51] Track 1: It's amazing how, how, when the customer tells you specifically what they want to buy, how easy it is 

[00:11:56] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Yeah, 

[00:11:56] Track 1: with a product to sell them.

[00:11:58] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: exactly. You know, it was, [00:12:00] it was funny. Like it, and that was the life-changing epiphany, like in the Holy Shit moment. The thing I talked about was the sense of rightness. I. Coupled with overwhelming motivation to see

[00:12:11] it through, that you don't necessarily, uh, like the, these life-changing epiphanies are usually sort of broad and fuzzy. Um, and then the details come later because you're, you're motivated to make it happen. But in that instant, that was, I'm, I read like three comments saying. Do a full year, turn it into a book. And I was like, fuck yes. And even though I knew it was a huge commitment that, and I didn't know necessarily if it was gonna make any money, but in that moment I said, yes, this is happening.

[00:12:42] And within a month there was like a million views. And so after a month I was like, I'm gonna do two years

[00:12:49] so so I did two years worth. And so that's, that's how it all

[00:12:54] began. And, uh, and yeah. So then, and now here we are.

[00:12:59] Track 1: In the middle [00:13:00] of that, uh, you were diagnosed with A DHD, which is fascinating to me also, I, I have, I have never been diagnosed, but more than a handful of people have said that people that work with a, people with A DHD or have it themselves say, I can't diagnose you, but I know my people and so.

[00:13:18] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: We do. I was, I, you know what I, I could see

[00:13:20] it .Yeah, 

[00:13:22] Track 1: so, so I'm, I'm just curious, you know, uh, my limited knowledge of what, what it means to have that diagnosis.

[00:13:30] I have had these epiphanies. I've had, I had one a couple of nights ago. I'm in the middle of a, a mini crisis myself. I. And it was this like idea, like, that's the thing I'm gonna do. This is gonna be amazing. But I've gotten really good at recognizing that. I get really excited about that stuff and like two days later, the reality of it kicks in and I'm like, oh God, that sounds like a lot of work.

[00:13:48] I don't think I'm gonna do that. So I don't know if that it, it sounds like the, the immediate feedback of an audience clamoring for what you were doing maybe helped fuel the fire, but had that not been there, do you, do you think it [00:14:00] would've, the A DHD situation would've changed the course of things for you?

[00:14:04] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Oh, if I hadn't gotten, if, if. It had not taken off. I can't imagine seeing it through. But the thing is, you know, we have a DH, ADHD is like a dopamine deficiency,

[00:14:16] and every single post there was reward.

[00:14:20] You know, some did better than others, but I could see that it was building instantly. And with, I mentioned having 80,000 followers on my Facebook page, it took nine years to build

[00:14:29] that. Uh, within a few years it was over 300,000.

[00:14:34] So it was, I was seeing that all of a sudden my page was getting way more engagement. Tons of comments. Everybody was loving it. Well, not everybody, it was actually a lot of people that hated it because, you know, I'm a very liberal

[00:14:45] guy, so I was getting a lot of Trump panes that were coming and shitting all over it.

[00:14:50] Um, which was great for interaction. I

[00:14:51] really appreciated that. They helped me sell books.

[00:14:54] Thank you very much, 

[00:14:55] Track 1: did.

[00:14:57] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: So, yeah, it was, there was constant positive [00:15:00] feedback. Every day. And, um, although not money yet, it took a bit before I was able to turn it into money. But then, you know, I, um, then I opened a Patreon, which I, um, ended up switching over to Substack, uh, and that was making a ton of money. The self-published book. Sold an absolute ass load of copies. So yeah, the combination of, uh, reader appreciation and more money that I'd ever made in my life, um, definitely was drove me forward.

[00:15:35] There's some, I actually gave a talk last November in Romania, um, a

[00:15:41] TEDx talk. Um, about the link between a DHD and creativity, and it was called, um, I, I referred to it as a superpower with kryptonite. And so it's a creative superpower. People with a DHD like our minds are all over the fucking map, right? Which means we find things [00:16:00] that we can, you know, it is the epitome of the outside the box thinking that that. We come up with weird little ideas that others might not, that we can incorporate into our art. And, and there, there's, you know, scientific research that shows that people with a DHD often are more creative. But one of the neat things about it. The thing that led to my diagnosis was the, was anxiety that even though I had successfully reinvented myself and um, was making lots of money, I noticed that my anxiety was through the roof.

[00:16:37] Like it was the worst it had ever been. And I thought, well, maybe it's because of c maybe it's because of, you know, the shit NATO of, you know, fascism. Uh, and, but then it was, it was two years ago. And Trump was out and I ha I was vaccinated. I was making lots of money. [00:17:00] Why am I still so stressed out?

[00:17:01] Track 1: PPSI for, forgive me if I'm wrong, you still live in Canada, right?

[00:17:05] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Yes.

[00:17:06] Track 1: I newly live in Canada. I just moved up here a couple years ago and I 

[00:17:08] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Welcome. 

[00:17:09] Track 1: the difference between living there during that shit and living here, I. , the anxiety charts. I mean, they, I was breaking 'em down there. It's, it's unbelievable what a different way of life it is up here.

[00:17:20] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Yeah. And well, I was just like, most of my readers were

[00:17:23] American and I've always been fascinated with the United States. Um, and, you know, we are neighbors, so I was, I was pretty, and I could see the way that it was affecting Canadian

[00:17:32] politics as well. Like there was, it was, it was rubbing off on us and. So I was, um, uh, you know, trying to figure out why am I still so anxious? And it was one of the bits of research that really explained it, that in preparing for this talk in Romania was that it's a, it's a little bit complicated to explain, but if you take someone with a [00:18:00] DHD and someone who doesn't have it, and they are engaged in a creative endeavor. And then you associate a reward with that creative endeavor, the person with A DHD is gonna work a hell of a lot more harder or a hell of a lot harder in order to, um, achieve more and more reward. And because I was self-published, I could see I. Pretty much instantly, uh, that every creative thing that I did, like I was shitting gold bricks at this point, um, that I could spend an hour writing this really unique creative advertisement, enticing people to buy my book, and I would post that on Facebook, and then I could look and see that. That ad just made me like almost a thousand dollars

[00:18:52] Track 1: that's,

[00:18:53] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: So that was me going overboard. Like I started to become obsessed

[00:18:57] and my fitness went to shit because [00:19:00] like, how do you go for a run when you could be making

[00:19:02] money? Um, how do you do housework or, um, you know, I gained the COVID-19 and then some. Um, so I worked out less.

[00:19:10] I cleaned the house less. I . Cooked less because I couldn't pull myself away from my computer. I was hyper fixated, not just on the writing, but on the

[00:19:18] marketing. I was really big into, because into sell your book, sell your book, sell your book because it's, it's money in the bank and it's like, you, you can just make so much money doing this. And that was, uh, you know, I was starting to have physical Anxiety symptoms, um, thumping heart, 

[00:19:38] uh, tingling skin, trouble sleeping, um, all that kind of stuff. And, uh, and I was like, this is fucked up, And there was a, a family diagnosis of A DHD. And I saw that, okay, well this is, you know, there's a genetic component and ended up getting diagnosed and, and tried a few different drugs.

[00:19:59] But [00:20:00] Ritalin was the one that, uh, that worked for me and. I take it, um, in the afternoon because it's an eight hour, uh, dose, which is kind of bullshit. It's more like six But, uh, but what it does is it allows me to step away from the obsession, uh, where I will get up in the morning. 'cause the thing is that, um, A DHD drugs can, um, tamp down your creativity. The, you know, you need to have that spider monkey on a meth bender brain that that in order to come up with your wildest shit that people

[00:20:34] wanna read. So I get up and I was always a morning writer, like I do my best work where I get up in the morning, grab a cup of coffee and head down to my office and just. Can just bang away.

[00:20:48] And, uh, then by about noon or so, then it's like, okay, now I have to do other shit, which can be, you know, other work associated things or exercising, [00:21:00] housework, grocery shopping, meal planning, preparation, all that kind of stuff. So when I feel like I've shot my creative wad for the day, then I can take the pill. It allows me to step away from it.

[00:21:12] And, um, the other thing is that now that I have, um. Uh, a big book deal. The, uh, the motivation to, um, well, I don't really have the ability to obsess over book sales anymore. 'cause like you get sort of a monthly

[00:21:29] statement and it's like, I got this massive advance for this book deal and I have to sell an absolute shit ton of books. Before the, the advance even earns out.

[00:21:43] So like, I'm not, I'm not at the point of getting more royalties right now. So it, it's like instead of, you know, it, it's, it's a lot. And, and I, I, I'm worried my publisher's gonna see this and say, fuck, he's not working right now. I am, I am. Um, [00:22:00] but the, the thing is that, that, when. I would go into sales mode and sell books. It was going into my bank account, you know, shortly thereafter.

[00:22:08] Whereas now it's, it's not necessarily an advance, isn't a debt, but it's kind of like I'm chipping away at a debt

[00:22:14] that if I don't chip it all away, I get to keep all the money anyway, So,

[00:22:20] So,

[00:22:20] I'm not saying I still wanna earn out the

[00:22:23] advance, but it's just, I'm not quite as psycho about it anymore.

[00:22:27] Track 1: So, but, so knowing that about yourself and the anxiety and the A DHD and the way it all plays together, does, does it hold you back? Like, is there an opposite side to the experience where you're like, oh, I'm not getting the hit out of it. So is it harder to, to stay motivated to keep driving, driving those sales and doing interviews like this?

[00:22:45] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: No. Um, it, it's, it's not, I, I would say that, uh, I mean I, I'm just fully committed to this career now,

[00:22:54] and, and it's, uh, now I have. The, [00:23:00] the, the potential opportunity. Like I've always been very financially motivated. Um, you know, once I didn't grow up with money, uh, once I was in my late teens and getting ready to move out, my mom started to make a lot of money. Um, she'd become a stockbroker and she started to do very well. So I didn't grow up with wealth, but then I saw that all of a sudden, you know, my mom started to make a shit ton of money, and I, and I was like. Money's cool. And she, when I finished my MBA, she wanted me to go into business with her.

[00:23:32] And I was like, there is not enough Ritalin in the world to get me to do that job. Like I was just, you know, it was the, the, you know, trading stocks to me was, was fake. Like it was just, it was numbers on a screen and it was, it was, there was no reality to it. For me, and, uh, you know, I was, I almost flunked outta university until I took a history course and realized that's my thing.

[00:23:57] Because growing up I was a shitty student. And the [00:24:00] one thing that I really liked, I loved reading fantasy novels and uh, and I thought, okay, reading history is like, you know, you still got the swords but not the sorcery and you can actually get a degree in this.

[00:24:12] So that was, that was why I ended up sort of obsessing over history and. Um, now with the whole A DHD, I think kind of forgot where I was going with this but, so I talked about being financially motivated that I kind of got into writing because I loved writing. That was a big part of it. But another big part of it was for the money, which is the stupidest thing anyone's ever said. because. Becoming a writer for the money is really

[00:24:40] dumb, but, um, 'cause almost nobody can do it. But I had a feeling, I had delusions of

[00:24:47] grandeur. I had a, I had a feeling that, that I could do it and if there was any way I was gonna make a lot of money, it was gonna be creatively because I didn't want a salaried position. [00:25:00] Um, you know, I wasn't a, a stockbroker trading kind of guy. Um. But you know, doing the MBA, it's like the difference between service income and product income. And I knew that if I could create, you know, a service income is like, you know, you write this article, you get paid 500 bucks, uh, you write more articles, you get more money, but there's only so much time in the day.

[00:25:20] Um, but I knew that books for me was the secret that, you know, my first two books didn't sell. And, but the thing, and you know, they worked out, I don't know, the first one, I think I averaged, it worked out to about maybe a dollar 50 an hour from what I

[00:25:37] put into it. Um, the second one was better. I think it was maybe about $12 an hour, $13 an hour. Um, and I don't even know what this one was, but it was a, it was a hell of a lot more than that.

[00:25:51] Track 1: A lot more. Nice.

[00:25:53] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Uh, but that was the idea is that you create one product and if it takes off, if it sells like mad, the sky is

[00:25:59] the limit. [00:26:00] Um, you know, I, I was, uh, the book Sapiens by Yuval Harari, that's one book that is sold over 20 million. I. Copies that probably made the author over $30 million

[00:26:10] for one book. And so that was the concept, was that, that I had this belief that I could, I could create a product that would sell like mad, but it, it had to be on my terms. It had to be something 

[00:26:22] creative. And, and so that was why I ended up going down that road and now seeing that, all right, there is demand for James Fell's sweary history stories. Um, and, and the money has been rolling in, but. Um, but it's not enough. Dammit,

[00:26:40] it's, yeah. Make I, I, I, I'd like, I'd like to have some ocean from property

[00:26:46] one day. Maybe. It's .So that's what's keeping me going now anyway.

[00:26:50] Track 1: Nice. I don't wanna keep you late. I know we're up against the clock. Do you have something else? Can I ask you one more question?

[00:26:55] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Oh yeah. It's, I take as much time as you want.

[00:26:57] We can keep going. 

[00:26:58] Track 1: cool. Uh, so [00:27:00] I want to ask you about the book, uh, particularly because, you know, you hear so often that if you wanna know what's gonna happen in the future, look to the past. You've, you've done some digging, you know what's happened in the past and the world's still a bit of a shit, nato. So what, what hope do you have?

[00:27:12] What, what do you see in the future with everything that's going on around us right now?

[00:27:17] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Oh boy. You know, um, that's a tough question and I am, I kind of stopped predicting the future after Trump won in 2016

[00:27:27] because, Uh, I, I'm concerned.

[00:27:30] Uh, you know, the, uh, the reason being is that when you look at history, it generally is those who are willing to lie, cheat, steal, and kill that end up on top. And, you know, the, there's no, there's a famous, well, quote, made famous by Dr. Martin Luther King, which is, um, the moral arc of the university's long, but it bends toward justice. [00:28:00] And unfortunately, I actually don't really think that's true.

[00:28:03] It, uh, it only bends toward justice if we force it to, and the people that are interested in the general wellbeing of, you know, their fellow humans, um, have a real fight on their hands against those that are malicious. And willing to do anything to win. And, you know, the, the more decent, caring folk are not willing to do anything to win because they have strong, a strong moral compass. And, you know, we're seeing that, you know, the, there are people that have to cheat to win and so they do. And, and so yeah, there's, there's a lot of fear that, uh, that things could, could. Go to shit. I, I was, I was very happy to see that Trump didn't get another term, but who knows what's gonna happen

[00:28:53] next year and with what's going on in the Middle East right now. And, you know, we've seen that, that in Italy there was [00:29:00] a, uh, a fascist government was elected and, uh, you know, the invasion of Ukraine is still going on. That. And also, you know, the, uh, there's a lot of money Put towards climate change denial. And, uh, I, I'm not necessarily so concerned for me as I am for my kids and one day potential, potentially grandkids, but, uh, it could go either way.

[00:29:24] Uh, we are a very brilliant, passionate, um, and, and resilient species that, uh, that things could work out. Or they could knock It's flip a coin. Who knows? I, I, I

[00:29:41] don't know. Um, I'm hopeful, but, uh, but also anxious

[00:29:47] Track 1: Yeah. Yeah. To, to your point about the, the cheaters, that, that was the breaking point for me. That literally the day that, uh, Ruth, bad Ginsburg died, and 45 minutes later, Mitch McConnell said, oh yeah, we're gonna fill our seat. I went up to my, we were living in, in the States. I went up to my wife and I [00:30:00] said, that's it.

[00:30:01] Our side won't cheat enough to win. We gotta get outta here and moved to Canada. And so here we are. We had, we had 

[00:30:07] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Yeah, I don't, I don't blame you. I mean, and, and with the recent, um, yet another

[00:30:13] mass shooting, uh, I, you know, I'll be out for a bike ride and some guy will, you know, cut me off in his car and I will swear my head off at, I can do that because the worst thing that's gonna happen is I'm gonna get punched in the face.

[00:30:29] And

[00:30:30] Whereas in the US I, I'd have to train myself to not do that because, you know, you swear at somebody and he's like, fuck you.

[00:30:39] Boom. So it's, uh, I, I do, I, you know, I, I like guns. I like, I. Shooting. Um, uh, you know, growing up I spent a lot of time in northwest BC with my dad, who you know, is a hunter. And, um, and I'm, you know, I've used guns a lot and, you know, they can be fun, [00:31:00] but I like our gun laws the way they

[00:31:02] are. And, uh, I like the fact that, you know, there aren't people carrying lethal weapons with them. The. At all times, it's, you know, the, the thought of that just scares the shit

[00:31:15] outta 

[00:31:15] Track 1: terrifying and, and, you know, kids in school and, and all that. It's, uh, it's awful. Uh, so it says, to bring us back to kind of full circle here for, for anyone who is maybe still waiting for that aha moment that puts 'em on the path to fame and fortune from their Facebook posts that turned into amazing books.

[00:31:33] Uh, what, what advice do you have for those people that are still kind of trying to figure it out, maybe trying to get over a hump right now? How, how can they get through it and, and yeah.

[00:31:42] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Um, so I, uh, I mean, I actually gave a talk at a writer's conference a couple of months ago that I broke it down to sort of three rules of success as a, as a creative person. Anyway, uh, rule number one was marry a doctor, um, ,which the, the, the broader [00:32:00] scope of that is to, Uh, to, you still gotta pay the bills because we are in a capitalist hellscape.

[00:32:08] So, um, you know, you have to realize that it's probably going to take a long time and you need to be willing to, um, to do this on the side while you still, I. Make money, have some type of backup plan. Like in my case, I had a very supportive spouse, but still like my first, when I started writing, I was able to do it because I got a job that was only 20 hours a week.

[00:32:35] That still paid quite well. It was an executive director role for a, for a not-for-profit. And uh, and it, it paid quite well. And that was my opportunity to spend another 20, 30 hours a week working on my writing career. And after two and a half years. Of that, it had taken off enough that I was making a decent enough living, doing the fitness, self-help, writing stuff, and um, and then when that didn't [00:33:00] work out. Um, and I switched to history. You know, my wife just said, you know what, we'll, we'll be okay. Like, just, just keep going and I, I think this is gonna work out for you. So having some type of financial backup is really important. The other thing is, you know, in, in my case, was being willing to be flexible. In terms of your passion, the, the example that I gave to the, this group of writers was, you know, your passion may be sentient sword wielding, samurai Cats writing about that and, and you know, that sounds like a cool book.

[00:33:35] I would totally read that, but it may not make a lot of money. So I told them, you know, don't necessarily fall in love with a genre. Fall in love with writing itself. So it may not be writing, it may be something in general, but, but you kind of have to chase the money. Somewhat like I'd wanted to be a, a fantasy novelist or a science fiction writer. And then I realized that you can't make a living doing that. Like unless you're, you know, [00:34:00] get super, super lucky. That's why I became a fitness writer was because I. I realized there were a lot of multiple income streams that I could generate from that, and it allowed me to write and, and it was something I knew a lot about and I thought, okay, well I can merge my passions here. And, and so you need to be flexible in terms of your passions that, that there are ways to be in. The field that you feel creatively or whatever it is that you need to be in, but also being realistic about, okay, it may not be a hundred percent exactly what you wanna do, but it's, it's in the area and then you can, you can chase the money and uh, and be happy at the same time and then maybe mold it as you go along and it can finance your sentient sword wielding samurai cat story if you want.

[00:34:53] Track 1: Absolutely 

[00:34:54] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: And then the third one, um, the, yeah, the, the rule number three. The last one was absolutely [00:35:00] be shameless in your promotion. Uh, that's something that, that writers specifically are pretty terrible at. But, you know, use that creativity that is compelling you to create this art and. We're put it into your marketing as well, that the reason why that I sold a lot of books wasn't because I just told people to buy my book over and over again. I creatively told them to buy my book,

[00:35:29] I, I told, I spinned a yarn. I told a cool story that, that pulled them in and, and then, then I said, buy my book,

[00:35:36] and, and that's what worked. 

[00:35:37] Track 1: was, gonna say, as a fan you lured me in many. I was like, this is a great stuff. And buy my book. Of course. Buy my book. 'cause everyth at the, I've got it. Perfect. . So. Awesome. Well, James, it's always super fun talking to you. I love reading everything you write. It's brilliant. Uh, it's a, it's a privilege to, to get, to spend this time with you.

[00:35:51] I really appreciate it. And, uh.

[00:35:52] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Oh, thanks so much, Jeremy. I I really appreciate you having me on the show.

[00:35:56] Track 1: We will do it again sometime. Thanks so much, James.

[00:35:58] james-fell_1_10-26-2023_140637: Count me in.[00:36:00] 

[00:36:00] ​